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A break from chromatic music. Diatonic.

And NO MORE Italian instructions - promise! Except words already adopted into English, like "tempo".

Perhaps it could be developed to make it a little longer.

Thank you if you give it a listen.

Cheers,

Dane

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Ingo and Ali, hello again,

Workflow? Having to click at least 4 keys to get in just one dotted note or several clicks of the mouse?

I sense a big difference between creative flow and workflow. A pencil dot on paper in a rough timeline is hugely more flowing to me....then comes the chore. 

But I have tried. There was no point getting notation software limited to 10 or 12 or 14 staves. Little use for the sketch end of composing. You can't just think "no, I don't like that", draw a bar line and do something different (but keep it in case you want to look back. 

It’s been a nightmare. Beautiful engraving but the rest? They're all as awkward by the look of it. Sheesh, I’ve never been as close to smashing the computer before!

Like, I have to be 100% accurate in the daw as the notation stuff can't easily interpret the xml. I got to 98 bars of detailed editing/engraving then found the following 110 bars to the end were blank, filled with rests. It never gave an error message on loading. I had to trim off the blank bars then prepare a new daw file with 99 bars chopped off the front guessing the flaw was in 99. It accepted this xml with all the music which I had to merge with the earlier bit, insert a bar and input bar 99 manually.  Thank the Good Lord it was just that. I couldn’t have faced entering 110 bars x 30 staves by hand.

Another time it inserted 5 beats in a 4/4 bar. Sorting it out meant shifting all subsequent notation staff by staff one beat back.

Many other issues. Still trying to find out how to force the note stems up or down on divisi parts without some workaround.

This isn’t really for me. A piece takes an elapsed 24 hours to compose then about an elapsed 2 months to get a computer to deal with it?

It’s a good thing, the way music is going that scores are increasingly unnecessary.

So I’ll probably end the trial without buying it, lovely though the engraving is. I know there's a lot to learn and have learned a heck of a lot in a couple of weeks plus....but....too frustrating.

Thank you all the same for advice and comment.

Ingo, you mean a tablet for rolling up a jolly old J? Isn't there an app for that yet? Comes with a portable 3-skinner roller?

:D

 

I like it very much, this short and adorable piece. The waltz rhythm is nicely hidden to be revealed by the listener. Lovely.

Cheers,

Kjell

Im currently writing a waltz too. My sounds dorky now after listening to yours haha. I really enjoyed it man. Something magic in all the space around it. Awesome 

Dane,

This is a charming and effective miniature. As usual your style of orchestration shows enormous sensitivity and resourcefulness - listening to this piece, where the instrumental combinations change with every phrase, brought to mind a composer whose name is not well known internationally: Havergal Brian. He's best known for his (somewhat notorious) Gothic Symphony, but he kept composing into his 90s, and his later work is much more compact and restrained in scale, and shows a very similar "kaleidoscopic" instrumentation in which the colors change with every phrase. In your work too, that constantly changing palette is one of many aspects that held my attention - but I can't neglect to mention the use of harmony, where the sense of key center keeps changing as well.

Bravo! Thanks for sharing it.

BTW, if you named the notation software you're using I missed it. MuseScore? Finale? SIbelius? Dorico? Whichever one it is, I am not surprised that the learning curve is steep after working in a DAW - I'm sure going in the reverse direction would be equally difficult!

Best wishes,

Liz

Hello Kjell,

Thank you indeed for listening to it and your kind comment. I sometimes turn to little numbers like this when I've had enough of my chromatic, sometimes atonal efforts. They make me feel better (if they work)!!

Kjell Prytz said:

I like it very much, this short and adorable piece. The waltz rhythm is nicely hidden to be revealed by the listener. Lovely.

Cheers,

Kjell

Hey Sean. 

Nope! Your waltz will probably have greater substance than this with plenty to engage the listener. Read music or not, you know what you're doing!

I look forward to listening to it.

Cheers

Sean Pollaro said:

Im currently writing a waltz too. My sounds dorky now after listening to yours haha. I really enjoyed it man. Something magic in all the space around it. Awesome 

Good morning Liz,

Many thanks for listening and your kind observations. I try to be imaginative with scoring but truth is it probably goes back to my early contact with amateur orchestras in which you have to work with what you've got. Also, important to give players something to do so they don't feel left out. There was an organisation: the Adult Education Institute - that provided venues for orchestras - alas it was scrapped about 10 years ago. Maybe secondary school (the 11-16 year old years) where I had an ensemble of 6 or 7 good players going and we arranged/composed all sorts of things. I wish I'd recorded more of my stuff just for memory's sake.

Hah, you mention Havergal Brian who does the same thing. Well, I know a few of his works (haven't listened to all his symphonies...I don't think he quite beat Haydn but it must have been close...)!! and, yes he does seem to do as you say.  I WELL remember that Gothic Symphony. Crikey, talk about huge! and his variegated instrumentation indeed shows up throughout. I recorded it off air. What struck me was how "modern" his technique was for 1919, considering Elgar's 2nd Symphony came from 1911. Mr Brian was a conscript in WW1 which no doubt interrupted his musical endeavours.

I've had sight of the score for the Gothic. It runs to 51 staves IIRC and in the Te Deum has an octet of clarinets all down to the contrabass. Massive. Thereafter, slowly, he moved onto less demanding, less imaginative work that is probably more accessible but has been neglected. So many composers were neglected by the BBC. A bloke in charge of programming called Glock decided that tonal music that made sense to most people had no place on Radio 3 and did all he could to promote avant garde. I should be pleased - but a great shame that good composers like Rubbra and George Lloyd barely got a look in.

Yes, it's a steep learning curve with notation stuff. As in Huxley's Brave New World, anything new has to be more complicated than what it replaces; and some of this notation stuff is unnatural. I'm getting used to its weirdities. Like when I write a bar of music with my pencil I start on the left and work to the right like I write text. Oh no, not this one. I can't start a bar with a rest. Ah well.....Right at the mo, I fear it might have killed the composer in me. I can't bear to open up either daw or notation stuff. I need this lockdown to end so I can get out to do a bit of playing and mixing with local musical people.

Again, Liz, many thanks.



Liz Atems said:

Dane,

This is a charming and effective miniature. As usual your style of orchestration shows enormous sensitivity and resourcefulness - listening to this piece, where the instrumental combinations change with every phrase, brought to mind a composer whose name is not well known internationally: Havergal Brian. He's best known for his (somewhat notorious) Gothic Symphony, but he kept composing into his 90s, and his later work is much more compact and restrained in scale, and shows a very similar "kaleidoscopic" instrumentation in which the colors change with every phrase. In your work too, that constantly changing palette is one of many aspects that held my attention - but I can't neglect to mention the use of harmony, where the sense of key center keeps changing as well.

Bravo! Thanks for sharing it.

BTW, if you named the notation software you're using I missed it. MuseScore? Finale? SIbelius? Dorico? Whichever one it is, I am not surprised that the learning curve is steep after working in a DAW - I'm sure going in the reverse direction would be equally difficult!

Best wishes,

Liz

Hi Dane,

I suggest that if you send me a regular .mid file of your input, I would like to try it to import it into MuseSCORE.

It would be an interesting test for me.  Maybe I could see your difficulties better.

Thanks.

Ali

PS. May be Gav would be interested in increasing cooperation between contributors of this forum.

Rather than working as seperate individuals, some collective work could be done.  ı remember around 1990s, there was a collective composition process which produced a single work about the second world war.  Wolfgang Rihm had contributed a song for a child voice with orchestra at the back...

Dane Aubrun said:

Ingo and Ali, hello again,

Workflow? Having to click at least 4 keys to get in just one dotted note or several clicks of the mouse?

I sense a big difference between creative flow and workflow. A pencil dot on paper in a rough timeline is hugely more flowing to me....then comes the chore. 

But I have tried. There was no point getting notation software limited to 10 or 12 or 14 staves. Little use for the sketch end of composing. You can't just think "no, I don't like that", draw a bar line and do something different (but keep it in case you want to look back. 

It’s been a nightmare. Beautiful engraving but the rest? They're all as awkward by the look of it. Sheesh, I’ve never been as close to smashing the computer before!

Like, I have to be 100% accurate in the daw as the notation stuff can't easily interpret the xml. I got to 98 bars of detailed editing/engraving then found the following 110 bars to the end were blank, filled with rests. It never gave an error message on loading. I had to trim off the blank bars then prepare a new daw file with 99 bars chopped off the front guessing the flaw was in 99. It accepted this xml with all the music which I had to merge with the earlier bit, insert a bar and input bar 99 manually.  Thank the Good Lord it was just that. I couldn’t have faced entering 110 bars x 30 staves by hand.

Another time it inserted 5 beats in a 4/4 bar. Sorting it out meant shifting all subsequent notation staff by staff one beat back.

Many other issues. Still trying to find out how to force the note stems up or down on divisi parts without some workaround.

This isn’t really for me. A piece takes an elapsed 24 hours to compose then about an elapsed 2 months to get a computer to deal with it?

It’s a good thing, the way music is going that scores are increasingly unnecessary.

So I’ll probably end the trial without buying it, lovely though the engraving is. I know there's a lot to learn and have learned a heck of a lot in a couple of weeks plus....but....too frustrating.

Thank you all the same for advice and comment.

Ingo, you mean a tablet for rolling up a jolly old J? Isn't there an app for that yet? Comes with a portable 3-skinner roller?

:D

 

Hi Ali,

By all means.

But did you mean the score that was giving me a total headache? I don't want to give the headache to you. It needed a lot of editing and the percussion lines don't work - that's because with VSL the instruments are assigned to certain pitches all over the midi range, where the notation software has set kit patterns. I'll have to sort that out.

Maybe a different but similar score I have yet to engrave?

Many thanks for the offer.

All good wishes,

Dane.

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