The Restitution

 In making this I was attempting to show much variety in the music without it sounding like a totally different piece. From a theory perspective I wanted it to go into some slightly unusual territory. Playing at the edges of abstract but maintaining a structure.

I made two copies. One for my Soundcloud and one for YouTube. My YouTube audio quality took the larger hit on upload. The SC Version seems a bit closer to the master. They both suffered as a result of audio compression.The YT version has notation posted although the violas are showing treble clef. If I were serious about moving this forward i would refine the notation presentation.

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  • While I realize that this probably isn't the best composition, this is an " analyze and critique" thread is it not? I have taken my valuable time to listen to some wonderful music here and in some cases bumped a few posts headed into oblivion so they would have some visibility. I have received some excellent critique from a few other forums. It seems that this forum in particular is prone to "Meism" to such an extent that we ignore our fellow posters? 

    If you were all so wonderful you would have no need to come to a place such as this to get someone to hear your work. If you came here to analyze someone else's work, you would have already done that. If you think you have arrived you probably don't belong here....hmmm, maybe you do. Birds of a feather flock together...I guess??

    In any case, this track has layed here for what 48 hours now? with not one comment. Can someone enlighten me here?

  • Well, I recognize this from some of my own postings. In my opinion the main cause of this phenomenon is not "Meism" but rather that there occur too many postings of new compositions and it takes a lot of time to make a sensible comment on works which are either written in a style one is not used to or show some other strange features. Moreover, it is only natural for composers to be occupied by their own work first and foremost. In my experience this can lead to what I call an "allergic reaction": I'm simply not always prepared and willing to listen to a piece of someone else, because my mind is too busy with my own stuff. 

    Perhaps you know that professionally I'm a philosopher and that music for me is just a secondary occupation. But I recognize a similar behaviour. For years I worked in the Philosophy Department of a Dutch university, where I observed the same phenomenon. My colleagues often more or less expected me to read their newly published articles, and I expected them to read mine. But actually we didn't, simply because we were all far too much involved with our own work, or better, by our own train of thought. Composing as well as thinking about philosophical problems are essentially solitary activities and one cannot always use the help or advice of others, because the other person is not familiar enough with the exact problems that occur during the creative process. 

    Usually I surf a little while at the Composers' Forum site about three or four times a week. I always see new postings of compositions here and hardly find time to seriously listen to any of them. And when I do, I often make a rather random choice about which works I will give a try to listen to. Mostly I have to listen several times to really grasp a new work, and even then it takes several days before I feel able to produce a comment. Often I don't comment, because the piece in question somehow doesn't sit well with me, while I'm unable to really put my finger on the sore spot. 

    I just listened to your piece, about an hour ago. It doesn't sound bad, but I find it too early to say something about it. 

    Another point is perhaps that composers, and artists in general, are often not so good in explaining to others what they do, how they work, &c. I intend no reproach by this. Producing is very different activity from appreciation and reflection. 

    Can you live with this? I would like to hear your thoughts.

  • A nice piece and I get what you mean about the compression. Soundcloud does it to us all. It seems to express the title with a vigorous opening fading into a more lyrical ending. Have to say you've done very well with a limited amount of instruments. The sound is well-balanced.

    I listened to yesterday and formed an impression, vaguely minimalistic in remaining in the same tonality throughout and wondered about the slower second part. I wrote a comment then wanted to look at the score in a new window. When I returned the reply pane was blank! So I'm listening again today and felt the work's mood. To me this should go with a video. (The score is a little blurry. Not starting at the start of the first page - no list of instruments - I had to work out what was being played!)

    Let's hope this comment doesn't disappear today! 

  • Hi Tim,

    Regarding not getting replies. You won't always. Sometimes you will, but you may have to give it more than 48 hours. In my observation, a week is not uncommon before a piece posted here will get a reply. Judging from your post you've been around long enough to know why people do and don't comment on works, so I probably can't offer you any new information on that. One thing I have observed about this forum (I've been around here for a while, the last 3 years as an admin, and 7 years before that as a member) is that it is generally more diverse in musical backgrounds of the membership than most classical-focused forums: you have people here posting in movie style, game style, pop, occasionally other things, and the age and compositional background varies from beginner to advanced. One other thing, most people who post here have jobs and lives and sometimes very little time to put into doing things here, mostly in the evenings from what I can tell. There are also a lot of one-offers: people who come in, post one thing, never comment on anybody else's work, and then disappear. So long-timers can be a little slow to respond to a new member because we want to see if the person is going to stick around before we put (our) valuable time into offering critique - 

    Best to you,


  • Thanks to those who commented. I want to address you better later in this message.

    This is the way it works for me. If you bothered to listen to one of my tracks I will oblige happily by listening to yours and comment the best I can. I will also listen and comment on tracks from those who have not commented on mine or anyone else's tracks with the difference that this won't be forever. If I see a trend where the person comes in, posts a track and then centers ONLY on their own work MULTIPLE times paying no attention to anyone else's work...they will be off of my list and ignored from then on by me. This person clearly does not have the concept of the site down correctly.

    I can see the wisdom in what Gav says here, in waiting until someone hangs around to see if they will reciprocate. The idea isn't that this is a talent show, but that this is a place where iron sharpens iron. Do you want to be sharpened? If not, then I'm not so sure this is the right place. Gav pays to keep a server going and the express purpose of it probably isn't to market your little YouTube video or mp3. I see it as a way to improve as a composer or to in the least, see different ways of looking at the same things. I really have no serious dog in this fight.....I have upwards of 175,000 plays on my own website. I don't need to come here for attention. I am also a part time musician. If I didn't do what I do ok they would let me know about it.

    *I would like to establish some kind of back and forth and hear others work. I think the process can be mind and thought expanding. This website is unique in that. Sometimes it seems though, more like a music bee going from website flower to flower pollinating quickly and then leaving. As someone who is always skeptical about just about everything don't think I haven't  considered for a minute that this website could be a way for someone to listen to music, copy it and sell it to music libraries. This is a trust issue and it has crossed my mind. I don't believe most would do that, but there are always a few. If you have ANY reservations I would copyright my work. Doesn't even need to be a direct copy. They could copy an idea or a passage. It would sicken me to think that someone took something I worked hard on and made money off of it when I never received a cent.

     Geert Ter Horst, THANK YOU for your very informative comments. Yes I can get into my own shell same as you. Yes I become involved into my own work same as you.I certainly understand your views because I think I share them. The fact that you took the time to address this says a lot about your character and I can tell you are a very deep thinker. It takes an extra effort to come outside of ourselves and critically listen to someone else's work. You have already done this numerous times as I have seen and so you should not feel as if you are not a positive contributor here.For me to do it I need to change gears. Take off my composer hat and put on my more open minded listener hat. It is very difficult I agree.As you have said, time is another factor here. We are all busy, yet if no one ever listened to any  other posts  the whole thing will eventually crash and burn. It can be a very uncomfortable place to be in trying to listen and comment on something alien to my ears...or so good I can't really say much about it. In that case a compliment is always in order! I don't think that I have properly grasped your music because the concepts of it are probably above me or a way of approach I could reckon. This is a good thing because now I can become educated in another mindset.

    Dane, You are good guy! Thanks for coming around to comment. I will take all into account here you have said. I reieived a few other comments, one quite flute player could play this long without taking a breath :) Another stated the  mid ranges in the mix are a bit too much. I agree with that for sure. Musically I can see where it doesn't feel connected or flow. These are all helpful both for this one and the next! 

    Have a good weekend!

  • I understand your viewpoint, Tim.

    It's give and take but more than a few fly-by-night posters pop up here. Not sure what their motives are. Perhaps they're just hoping their ditties will get a listen or two. So although I may (as a matter of whimsy) comment on the work of a member who hasn't yet, on others' work, the default is now "don't". 

    It takes time which is precious because instrument practice calls; composing; writing out scores and a few other things. I find it selfish expecting others to comment on someone's work while they don't return what's tantamount to the favour. 

    No doubt we'll talk again, Tim

    Cheers, Dane

  • Hi Tim,

    this is beautiful music. I enjoyed every moment of it. You have managed to develop a personal style where you are able to express your most inner emotions and that creates good music.



  • Dane,

    Yes I see yours and Gav's point completely. Thanks for stopping by! I forget , what instrument do you play?

    Kjell, Thank you for listening to this. Much appreciated.

  • Viola. I'm about grade 6 ABRSM but can only afford about an hour's practice a day. Also play the piano a bit and give that a whirl every now and again. I still do my finger-independence exercises away from the keyboard if a few moments arise.

  • Hi Timothy,

    With interest I've listened to your piece. It is somewhat unusual to my classical ears (as to music, but also as to orchestral seatings, use of the playing 'space'). That's probably because you don't use a DAW to create that space and depth. I guess you didn't pay any attention on the sonic realism of the instruments used (the flute seems pretty much OK though, even with the little glissandi; is it a tin whistle?). It's definitely a different approach, but you've shown your intention and that is the most important thing. You gave us an insight in the way you work and think about music. That matters most.

    Good work!


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