Symptoms of a Bigger Problem

If you follow classical music news like I do you would have seen some very troubling headlines.

Osmo Vänskä's departure shakes Minnesota Orchestra

If you are not familiar with the on going issues the Minnesota Orchestra has had with their Board of Directors you should definitely look it up to fully understand how it got to where they are now

New York City Opera Shuts Its Doors

CANCELLED: Carnegie Hall Live: Opening Night Gala With The Philadelphia Orchestra due to IATSE/Local One strike

Without An Angel Donor, The Detroit Symphony Orchestra Could Go Dark

keep in mind this orchestra is currently accepting scores for a new competition. 

Many blame changing audience taste, crazy new music, MTV culture, shorten attentions spans, snobbishness of symphony goes, and high ticket prices for the decline in audience sizes at the symphony. All legit reasons but their seems to be a bigger problem at hand, a problem from within many failing orchestras, opera companies, and professional performing ensembles. While each situation is different, an underline theme that I see throughout each of these performing groups is some kind of mismanagement. It appears that many orchestras have yet to keep up with the times and run their business as they did 100 years ago. So what can be done?

What do you think is the main issue for these failing performance ensembles? What do you think needs to be changed?

You need to be a member of Composers' Forum to add comments!

Join Composers' Forum

Email me when people reply –

Replies

  • Belated reply to Frederick zinos:

    He said,

    1. “Ondib, you missed the point.”

    I think you may be wrong about that.

    2. “No one cares what Henry Ford said.”

    That is demonstrably false. According to a recent survey, an infinite number of sentient, omniscient beings in the universe care passionately about what Ford said, except for one or two living on a small satellite revolving around the star Antares.

    3. “Therefore it is up to us who are more or less alive to make up things he might say if he were still alive.”

    That implies a moral obligation that cannot be established by utilitarian or by de-ontological systems of ethics.

    4. ‘And Ford missed the point too. He didn't seem to be able to provide what people wanted. When he asked (or axed) what people wanted, they told him "faster horses".’

    That is exactly what he did provide. My horse is very fast.

    “The other thing wrong with your citation is that it claims Henry uttered these words in 1916. 1916? Improbable since the world didn't begin until much later.”

    I was relying on a different calendar than the one you appear to be using. Only when all calendars and timepieces are destroyed, will we truly know when things happened.


    “In fact by a stellar coincidence . . .”

    : ) You know very well, there is no such things as a coincidence.



    “. . . the world, the stars the cosmos and all of creation began the day I was born . . .”

    I would have to see your birth certificate and the birth certificate of the cosmos and of creation to verify that. However, you may be right about that.


    As far as your more recent point about “illusion” is concerned, you are absolutely correct on that point, especially as concerns art and music.

    “The ultimate purpose of any art form is, by a set of illusions, to suggest a higher level of reality in the cosmos, to reorient the feelings of the time-bound mind towards an awareness of the supra-temporal and sempiternal.”

    --Pith Agh Orasz




    Fredrick zinos said:

    Ondib, you missed the point. No one cares what Henry Ford said or didn't say because he is dead. He used to say things but not any more. Therefore it is up to us who are more or less alive to make up things he might say if he were still alive.

    And Ford missed the point too. He didn't seem to be able to provide what people wanted. When he asked (or axed) what people wanted, they told him "faster horses". Well, look what a mess he made of THAT. Based on that, I just cant' bring myself to trust old Hank as a reliable authority on bedding.

    The other thing wrong with your citation is that it claims Henry uttered these words in 1916. 1916? Improbable since the world didn't begin until much later, in fact by a stellar coincidence, the world, the stars the cosmos and all of creation began the day I was born. 

    Index of /
  • Sorry, Bob.

    The citation of the survey of an infinite number of omniscient beings is itself infinitely long (in Cantor's sense of being uncountably infinite); therefore I cannot fit the citation into this limited space.

    >

    >Ondib
    >
    >Again please site a reference for your survey.

    >

  • Regarding the question, who invented the automobile?

    I think Archimedes invented one, and Ford invented one, and the Wright Brothers made one that could fly.

    Werner von Braun made one too, that could go all the way to Tipperary, even though it's a long way to go . . .



  • SYMPTOMS OF A BIGGER PROBLEM.

    What are the cultural symptoms, and what is the cultural problem?

    Charles Ives, who lived in obscurity as a composer, during his lifetime, was often asked, about his scores,

    "Why do you write so much ——— which no one ever sees?"

    Charles Ives thought these questions were far more important:

    " "Is not beauty in music too often confused with something which lets the ears lie back in an easy-chair? Many sounds that we are used to do not bother us, and for that reason are we not too easily inclined to call them beautiful? . . . Possibly the fondness for personal expression—the kind in which self-indulgence dresses up and miscalls itself freedom—may throw out a skin-deep arrangement, which is readily accepted at first as beautiful—formulae that weaken rather than toughen the musical-muscles. If a composer's conception of his art, its functions and ideals, even if sincere[5], coincides to such an extent with these groove-colored permutations of tried-out progressions in expediency so that he can arrange them over and over again to his delight—has he or has he not been drugged with an overdose of habit-forming sounds?"

    http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Postface_to_114_Songs/Postface_to_114...


  • I recently watched a show about Mel Fisher- who searched for the' treasure' of

    a sunken ship for 15 yrs. before he and his team finally found it.

    If he had a map rather than rumors and bits and pieces of history, I'll bet

    he'd a been dancin' to the music a lot sooner........(even if the map was encrypted in music

    notation) lol      RS

    Bob Porter said:

    The place exists. No map required.

    This was the idea of a brief discussion in theory class one day. But then it was the early 70's.



  • First, there is the idea, the concept of the music.

    Secondly, there is the recording of the idea: in a score, a piano roll, or nowadays, in a computer file. The ancient Greeks even carved some of their musical works in stone (such as the Hymn to Nemesis).

    Lastly, there is the "performance." (Or the audio recording of the performance).

    You can listen here to an actual performance by Charles Ives.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXHjeSamzno

    Of course, Charles Ives did not became famous as one of America's greatest composers because of his performances. The ideas in his works made him worthy of attention, and when others finally saw this, long after his death, they brought him before a wider public, through performances.

    Prokofiev said, not long after the composition of his second Piano Concerto, "I have no time for performance now. In the time it takes me to rehearse and perform a single piece, I can write many new works."

    Isn't this how a "composer" thinks?

    Music is born in the soul. Not in the world.



  • I sink zhe new musik ist much better zhan zhat old stuff, like zhe Milkey Cypress und Yoostin Bieber. Try tverkink to zhe Resurrection Symphony, unmoeglich!

  • How did I understand this?

    Johann Von Keugelschnitzenheimer said:

    I sink zhe new musik ist much better zhan zhat old stuff, like zhe Milkey Cypress und Yoostin Bieber. Try tverkink to zhe Resurrection Symphony, unmoeglich!

  • Fred, those few shares of apple only give you the ability to know if you are

             writing good or bad music. You will always be able to write music -

             even after the dirge is played. (see Isaac Newton- conservation of energy)
     
    Fredrick zinos said:

    I generally agree with what has been said on this forum but don't quite get the bit about the soul, having sold mine for a few more shares of apple. And I am saddened to learn of the continuing problems on Cypress. I thought those had all been sorted out in the 1940s

  • I don't know what people mean when they talk about "tonality" (as if that is the mode that Bach used); or what they mean when they talk about something else which supposedly is NOT tonality.

    There are simply many kinds, types, and varieties of tonality.

    Here is a very interesting one, invented apparently by Ives.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU85bUyDPWs

    Charles Ives: 3 Quarter-Tone Pieces (1924) - II. Allegro

    He has two piano players perform an integrated piece, with the two pianos tuned one quarter tone apart. It's a marvel. And to think, he wrote this in 1924, NINETY YEARS AGO. We need more work like this, and we do well to learn, to hear and to become accustomed to a wide varieties of "tonalities," and not just the simple, hackneyed tonalities which are so overused to the point of dullness.

    Refusal to learn about other tonalities is like the refusal to learn other languages, or to visit other countries. There are limitless domains beyond the horizon.

    Free yourself from the bondage of traditional thinking, listening and composing. Going "back" is not the answer. We may as well just beat the stick on the rock, and say, "that's the best way, and it always will be."

    Would you have asked Beethoven, Schubert and Schumann to "go back" to the tonality of the Baroque era? Would you have asked Wagner to "go back" to the era of the early romanticism?

    Would you have told Stravinksy, Milhaud and Prokofiev to abandon their polyrhythms and polytonality?

    We have yet to catch up with Ives and Schoenberg, much less Messiaen, Berio and Stockhausen.

This reply was deleted.