Interstellar String Quartet

Douwe Ziel July 29, 2013 at 4:56am

Oh my. Though I don't find it interstellar, I would LOVE to hear this played by a real string quartet

Alexey Arkhipenko July 29, 2013 at 4:59am

Thank you :)

I hope to post a recording of real performance of some parts in october.

As for the title, it relates to some of the parts.

Alexey Arkhipenko July 29, 2013 at 5:12am

Michael, thank you for you comments.

I am mostly waiting for critics, who would point out the problems in the compositions.

I listened to your Symphonata and liked its relaxed minimalistic feeling.

Andrew Gleibman July 30, 2013 at 6:16pm

I like this music very much, and it will sound really good in a live performance. Will depend on the performers though.

Trying to provide some constructive critics about the virtual instruments applied:

1) All instruments (to my ear) sound too wet and sharp. This music asks for milder and more contemplative sounds.

2) Not enough timbre contrasts between different instruments to make a good polyphony of 1st Violin with 2nd violin, 1st Violin with viola, viola with cello etc.

You can achieve better results if you have enough instrument samples, but this may require a lot of work. You need to chose 4 sampled string solo instruments, not necessarily exactly as they are named in the score, and compare all 6 possible pairs of chosen instruments so that you hear well the difference in timbres in every pair. (4 instruments form 6 possible pairs). Also you may need to check how these pairs sound in different audio devices (headphones, external monitors). I spent all last week in such trials and still look for better instrument pairs and sound parameters (pan, reverberation etc) for the planned setting.

There exist a lot of string instrument samples, e.g. for "singing" viola and "spacious" cello, whose c1 and c2 are very different from those of violins.

Alexey Arkhipenko July 30, 2013 at 7:07pm

Andrew, what do you mean by "too wet" ? Do you mean "too much space, too much reverberation" or "too much vibrato"?

By saying "too sharp" do you mean "too loud accents and too fast dynamic growth" or "too close-to-the-instrument sound and too much high frequencies" ?

I began to realize one of the "solo sample killers". It is vibrato. Being not able to control vibrato in solo samples can be a problem - either selecting no vibrato or a lot of vibrato. I think, I overused vibrato in Interstellar, especially in long notes, and I would try to cope with it later. Vibrato sounds too fast and too intensive.

What you say about timbre is very interesting to me. I do these comparison checks every time I use sampling, but not so thoroughly. Can you please share some examples of "good" and "bad" timbre pairs (I mean, so that forum readers can listen to the examples)? Or can you please write the seconds of the tracks, where you hear bad timbre pairs?

What library does contain "spacious" and "singing" samples?

Andrew Gleibman said:

I like this music very much, and it will sound really good in a live performance. Will depend on the performers though.

Trying to provide some constructive critics about the virtual instruments applied:

1) All instruments (to my ear) sound too wet and sharp. This music asks for milder and more contemplative sounds.

2) Not enough timbre contrasts between different instruments to make a good polyphony of 1st Violin with 2nd violin, 1st Violin with viola, viola with cello etc.

You can achieve better results if you have enough instrument samples, but this may require a lot of work. You need to chose 4 sampled string solo instruments, not necessarily exactly as they are named in the score, and compare all 6 possible pairs of chosen instruments so that you hear well the difference in timbres in every pair. (4 instruments form 6 possible pairs). Also you may need to check how these pairs sound in different audio devices (headphones, external monitors). I spent all last week in such trials and still look for better instrument pairs and sound parameters (pan, reverberation etc) for the planned setting.

There exist a lot of string instrument samples, e.g. for "singing" viola and "spacious" cello, whose c1 and c2 are very different from those of violins.

Interstellar String Quartet

Hi! This is my first post on the forum. First I would like to say that I am very glad to find a forum, where people post compositions, that I really…

Andrew Gleibman July 30, 2013 at 8:47pm

Maybe "wet" is not a correct term. I mean too "metallic" sound, like "metal slides against metal". Too much high frequencies is a correct term for this. This is not related to reverberation -- this is a feature of specific instrument & bow motion.

Then, for all 4 instruments, which you use, I do not hear much timbre difference. With some exaggeration, string instruments may contrast to each other by timbres almost as much as strings with woodwind instruments. Example where 4 really different string timbres may give a richer sound: bars 20-21 in your "Dark Crusade" where you use imitation. Then, in bar 22, a Violin 2 player would probably try to contrast this response using another timbre, not only using change in the dynamics.

I do not think it is possible to create a realistic vibrato or portamento from general string samples. Besides, every human performer will perform them in a different way. This is the reason why automatic score in principle cannot compete with live performance. So many parameters cannot be controlled beforehand, in the score. They can be controlled only in real time, by live human feelings.

My library today is rather limited: it is Yamaha S90 ES (almost 1000 virtual instruments overall, some are very good). I will try to give string contrast examples later. Some example (not too good) can be heard in 2nd movement of Mystical Suite (time positions 2'10" and 2'27") in my CF page player (please hear through good headphones, not through loudspeakers).

Alexey Arkhipenko July 31, 2013 at 5:12am

I tried to listen to 2'10 and 2'27. It is rather difficult to analyse without a rewind feature. Do you have an mp3 link or external player with rewind? Was the whole suite recorded with Yamaha S90 ES? Did you play every part or send output to Yamaha from sequencer?

I hear my vibrato problems in the long notes of your suite too. Short notes with changing pitch tend to sound more natural. Also to me there is lack of dynamic changes: most of notes sound has constant volume and finishes abruptly.

Thank you, I will try to work with 20-22 bars and post results.

Andrew Gleibman July 31, 2013 at 8:30am

The contrast of two different violin samples can be best heard around 2'20" -- 2'45" time position here:

http://www.soundclick.com/player/single_player.cfm?songid=9630514&a...

For rewinding simply move the cursor.

Thanks for the feedback. The suite was improvised and post-edited using S90 ES (including real-time controlled arpeggiator).

Alexey Arkhipenko July 31, 2013 at 3:58pm

Sorry, seems I could not make it - more than two instruments sound simultaneously and I am distracted :)

Andrew Gleibman said:

The contrast of two different violin samples can be best heard around 2'20" -- 2'45" time position here:

http://www.soundclick.com/player/single_player.cfm?songid=9630514&a...

For rewinding simply move the cursor.

Thanks for the feedback. The suite was improvised and post-edited using S90 ES (including real-time controlled arpeggiator).

Interstellar String Quartet

Hi! This is my first post on the forum. First I would like to say that I am very glad to find a forum, where people post compositions, that I really…

Andrew Gleibman July 31, 2013 at 7:43pm

Never mind, I'll try to post something else.

I'm sure some members of this forum can showcase a violin + viola or violin + cello polyphony with distinct individual features of every instrument.

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Interstellar String Quartet

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