which is the best score/notating software to use?

[Jay Toul]

Hi all,

I currently use Ableton live to record music, even though I am somewhat still a beginner at it.  It doesn't have the ability to record notation though.  I am trying to figure what might be the best notation software to use for the purpose of being able to hand out the notation to band members.  Basically, I want to record in Ableton and then use a notation software to document the notes and chords to hand out so others can use it.

I would appreciate if anybody has any input.  

I started to create a comparison matrix of some of the notation software I found online - http://www.choosle.com/app#DYK5.Q0MhgE-VvRbA1QNB.edit    but didn't get that far.

If anybody has any suggestions, the comparison matrix is also editable to add factors or other notation software options.

I am also wondering if anybody knows if there is a good way to convert wav or mp3 to a midi file?

Anyway, thanks and I would appreciate anybody's help

[Andrew Gleibman]

>> I am also wondering if anybody knows if there is a good way to convert wav or mp3 to a midi file?

This is impossible. It is like attempting to convert a bread back into wheat seeds. MIDI file is a "recipe", or a "program" for extracting sounds (in form of WAV etc) from your electronic instruments, not in the opposite direction.

There exist basic unsucessful attempts to move in opposite directions by those who do not understand the complexity of this.

[Michael Tauben]

Actually there is a program - Melodyne by Celemony which I use for fixing tuning and timing problems on audio recordings. You can create a midi file from an audio track and even  change a note within a chord.

However, it works ok on individual tracks and not on a whole mix.

Andrew Gleibman said:

>> I am also wondering if anybody knows if there is a good way to convert wav or mp3 to a midi file?

This is impossible. It is like attempting to convert a bread back into wheat seeds. MIDI file is a "recipe", or a "program" for extracting sounds (in form of WAV etc) from your electronic instruments, not in the opposite direction.

There exist basic unsucessful attempts to move in opposite directions by those who do not understand the complexity of this.

[Simon Godden]

Andrew's right.  You can't turn a wav or mp3 file back into midi.  Otherwise, you would be able to buy CDs of live recordings of pop and classical music and turn them into scores.  It would be easier to build a time machine.

[Michael Tauben]

As I said above - you can do it but on the individual parts, flute, violin etc...not the whole texture.

Instead of building a time machine, however, why not practice notating the parts the old fashioned way, by ear!  

Oh and btw, it is possible to travel forward in time but not backwards (yet).

LOL

Simon Godden said:

Andrew's right.  You can't turn a wav or mp3 file back into midi.  Otherwise, you would be able to buy CDs of live recordings of pop and classical music and turn them into scores.  It would be easier to build a time machine.

[Adrian Allan]

It is amazing how far Melodyne has actually got with transposing polyphonic and homphonic (chords) into midi that can be manipulated. Have you seen the demos, Simon? It really is getting closer to the point where scores can be made from CDs. Not quite there, but Melodyne is a significant step - give it 10 years, I would say...

[Simon Godden]

Well, considering what's been achieved in the last 20 years, maybe you're right.  I'm looking forward to the day when I can go to Vienna, enter a time machine and travel back to 1825 and give Schubert some penicillin for his syphillis.

[Jay Toul]

thanks, Melodyne is close to what I was looking for - something to translate the individual track/instrument.  My goal is too play and record each instrument myself and then be able translate to a midi, so I can then automatically document each individual instrument to send to the band so they know what to play.

Anybody in a band, I would be also curious how they go about notating or organizing their compositions?

[Simon Godden]

I'm not in a band, but if you can a midi file out of Melodyne, buy Finale and you can do anything with it.

Jay Toul said:

thanks, Melodyne is close to what I was looking for - something to translate the individual track/instrument.  My goal is too play and record each instrument myself and then be able translate to a midi, so I can then automatically document each individual instrument to send to the band so they know what to play.

Anybody in a band, I would be also curious how they go about notating or organizing their compositions?

[Michael Tauben]

That seems like a very complicated way of doing things!

What kind of band do you play in? Not a concert band I presume, unless you play all those woodwind and brass instruments!!
If you're talking guitars, basses, keyboards and drums that's different but still full of pitfalls.

It would be much much quicker to play the parts on a midi keyboard into a sequencer or notation program.

Or even record the audio and let the band members work it out by ear and make their own charts!!

Jay Toul said:

thanks, Melodyne is close to what I was looking for - something to translate the individual track/instrument.  My goal is too play and record each instrument myself and then be able translate to a midi, so I can then automatically document each individual instrument to send to the band so they know what to play.

Anybody in a band, I would be also curious how they go about notating or organizing their compositions?

[Andrew Gleibman]

Yes, many instruments now have MIDI outputs for inserting into a computer, so (I think) it is impractical to convert audio to MIDI; it is better to aply MIDI-featured instruments.

You should know, however, that MIDI generally is not a human-readable format: it is a computer-readable format. Converting it to a conventional human-readable score is not a trivial task.

[Michael Tauben]

That's for sure! Basically, the software has yet to be invented that allows a person to produce printed music without that person having an extensive knowledge of notation. Who would trust it to be accurate? Even when I have played a part into a sequencer, checked it back, quantised it to the correct note values and exported it as a midi file- when I import it into Finale there are still errors!!

Andrew Gleibman said:

Yes, many instruments now have MIDI outputs for inserting into a computer, so (I think) it is impractical to convert audio to MIDI; it is better to aply MIDI-featured instruments.

You should know, however, that MIDI generally is not a human-readable format: it is a computer-readable format. Converting it to a conventional human-readable score is not a trivial task.

[Michael Staff]

I've heard good things about Finale although I use Sibelius and love it. It can do just about anything and the newer versions even have a feature to record an audio file once the score is notated.