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Hi All

Anyone using VEP 7 & Kontakt? I've just upgraded from Vienna Ensemble to VEP 7 but I can't figure out how to use the KP properly with it. Specifically, In Dorico I have five tracks, each connected to the same VEP instance. In the vep server instance I have the Kontakt player loaded as a plugin with five separate instruments on channels 1-5. Problem is I can only get playback from channel 1, nothing from the other channels.

Compare this with using Padshop 2 as a vep plugin. I can have five instances of padshop on channels 1-5 in vep and there is no problem with playback from any channel. 

So I must be doing something wrong with Kontakt. If anyone has any idea of what I'm doing wrong I would be greatfull for a heads up.

Cheers, Colin D

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Colin, I don't use either Kontakt or VEPro but I came across a post on the VSL forum that discusses using Kontakt with VEPro..

Hi

Thanks, I'll have a try with this in mind. Colin

Check to make sure the MIDI channel # in the Kontakt player (under "Port A [from host]") also matches the MIDI channel in VEP (Kontakt defaults to 1 when you load it, so I always need to change it)

I use both of these vsti's. and I gave up on using Kontakt within Vepro. From what I saw on the VI forum, it may not even be possible, or at least is extremely difficult. 

I purchased Vepro because of the great price, plus the free Epic Orchestra (EO). The bottom line for me: I use Vepro exactly as I did the free Vienna Ensemble (EP) player. No difference. With EO, I got a Cornet, Oboe D'Amore, and a few string patches. The rest not usable. All in all, I would have been better off staying with EP, and spending my money on better strings. (I did eventually get Appasionata Strings at a discount, but then not long after they put Dimension Strings on sale, a better library, but I had already spent my money...typical for my luck in this area.). 

I've made some progress. I can load multiple instances of Kontakt into a single VEP instance but in order to address each of them I need to change the port numbers. So three Kontakt instances would be addressed as 1.1, 2.1, and 3.1 and so on. The midi channel number always needs to be 1. So I can't address them as 1.1, 1.2, and 1,3, which is what I would expect to be able to do. This is what I can do with multiple VI tracks and mono-timbral synths.

I'm thinking the issue is to do with the fact that Kontakt is a multi-timbral instrument. A single instance of Kontakt can load several instruments which can be addressed which can be addressed sequentially on the same port as 1.1, 1.2, and so on. It's easy to do this when Kontakt is loaded inside the daw/notation program but no so easy as when its loaded outside as is the case with vep. I know it can be done in vep but I just haven't figured it out yet so I'll keep on trying.

Colin

Michael....hi

I don't want to divert the thread but I'm particularly interested in this. I'm more of a musician than a tech guy so I'm reluctant to get tied up in jargon which would be the case if I queried this on VSL's forum so....

What extra did you need to do to your projects to get them to work in VEpro when converting from VE (free player). Did they work straight away? (Asking because I'd like more slots in the rack if I bought the organ software. The VE player only has 4). I'm not interested in the EO either!  

michael diemer said:

I use both of these vsti's. and I gave up on using Kontakt within Vepro. From what I saw on the VI forum, it may not even be possible, or at least is extremely difficult. 

I purchased Vepro because of the great price, plus the free Epic Orchestra (EO). The bottom line for me: I use Vepro exactly as I did the free Vienna Ensemble (EP) player. No difference. With EO, I got a Cornet, Oboe D'Amore, and a few string patches. The rest not usable. All in all, I would have been better off staying with EP, and spending my money on better strings. (I did eventually get Appasionata Strings at a discount, but then not long after they put Dimension Strings on sale, a better library, but I had already spent my money...typical for my luck in this area.). 

Dane, it's pretty straightforward to migrate your EP projects to Vepro. Although at the moment I forget how you do it, but the manual is fairly clear on this (with the caveat that manuals in general seem to purposefully obfuscate what they are trying to tell you). Your project will then work in Vepro exactly as in EP, except that now the Vepro player will remain open at the bottom of your screen, and self-load when you open the project. Unfortunately, this means that if you have a power failure, or decide to shut down without first saving and closing Vepro, you will have to first open a blank instance of Vepro before you load the project. If you don't, you have to close your project and do it the "right" way. As with all "improved" products, it's a judgment call whether the added functionality is worth the added hassle.

Colin, I'm glad you are having some success. I'm sure you'll get there. Keep us informed. Me, I keep it simple (I actually would prefer living in the woods in a cabin, but marriage has set me back on that Thoreauvian fantasy). I might someday decide to use Vepro as it is intended, but for now I just don't see the benefit. For one, I highly doubt it will ever be possible to put all your vsti's inside Vepro. So, rather than use a hybrid system, I just decided to continue using my VI libraries as separate vsti's. If I open an old project, and it's in EP, I keep it in EP. If a project is in Vepro, I keep it in Vepro. You can even have both Vepro and EP in the same project. If you don't want to put all your vsti's in Vepro, then Vepro is just like EP. No difference. Except for when you forget to save and close before shutting down. Then you have to consult the manual again on how to get it up and running again. At least I do, but that's because, like Dane, I'm not a tech guy. Also I'm not getting any younger, and things don't stay in my memory as long. 

Thank you for your reply, Michael. Most cautionary. I think I can dld the manual without buying it. Well, this isn't the place to discuss VSL software as a subject alone except I can't help say the VEpro must be quite something. Over the months I've become amazed at the power of the free VE player, especially allowing me to adjust dynamic range and volume of every articulation of every instrument along with the panning. And there's still more to learn!

I'd just like more slots and the polyphonic legatos, etc. 

michael diemer said:

Dane, it's pretty straightforward to migrate your EP projects to Vepro. Although at the moment I forget how you do it, but the manual is fairly clear on this (with the caveat that manuals in general seem to purposefully obfuscate what they are trying to tell you). Your project will then work in Vepro exactly as in EP, except that now the Vepro player will remain open at the bottom of your screen, and self-load when you open the project. Unfortunately, this means that if you have a power failure, or decide to shut down without first saving and closing Vepro, you will have to first open a blank instance of Vepro before you load the project. If you don't, you have to close your project and do it the "right" way. As with all "improved" products, it's a judgment call whether the added functionality is worth the added hassle.

 

Hi

I'm using VE Pro mainly because Dorico Pro 2 was giving me a hard time with load/unload times with VE and generally slowing down when I'm using a lot of libraries (esp VSL) - loading all the libraries into a host takes a lot of the strain away from your daw/notation program. At the moment I'm trying out the free trial for Dorico Pro 3 and both versions run a lot better with VE Pro. The reason I'm trying to get Kontakt to work "properly" is mostly because I would like to get it to work the way it's designed to work rather than making do with second best workarounds.

VE can do a lot, VE Pro can do  a whole lot more - it's just a matter of patience and luck finding out how.

Apropos nothing in particular, I bought NI's Session Horns Pro in their 50% off sale - I have a few big band tunes I would like to re-work. I haven't done much with it yet but its looking promising.

Cheers, Colin

Good luck in finding a solution for this Colin. VE Pro looks like an interesting program.

I guess we all have differing approaches and ways of working that work best for us. My personal approach is to almost never have any kind of vst shell with too much in it. I'm not saying it is any better or worse than any other way of working. 

 I simply drag what I want over to a track assign it a midi channel and play it. I seldom use Kontakt multis. I will have maybe 10 instances of Kontakt instead. The differences in cpu usage are not much different so long as I don't load 50 instances. The other advantage is I can use other lesser known synths or samples other than Kontakt. 

Kontakt scripting was never something I had the time to get into other than to maybe select a pre written script. Most decent libraries have pretty good programming in them already. If you can't get scripting to work maybe the VE pro website/forum could help? Good luck!

Good post, Tim. There are always many ways to use music software. We each must find what works for how we ourselves work (i.e. workflow), what kind of system we have, and whether we like to keeps things simple or gravitate more toward complexity.

I use GPO, EWSO Gold, Vienna Special Edition 1, Cinematic Strings 2, Appasionata Strings (Vienna Synchron Player Edition), And also some sounds from the Dimension Pro Synth from Cakewalk, which has some good stuff on it for classical composers. Here's my method:

One Aria synth, for GPO (not multi). Usually I have a few patches on it.

One Play synth for EWSO Gold. again, just a few patches.

One instance of either Vienna Ensemble, or Vepro. I have maybe 8-10 patches typically. VI sounds are just better.

One Kontakt Player, for Cinematic Strings.

One Synchron Player for each string group in Appasionata Strings. Synchron Player is not multi-timbral.

One Dimension Pro for each patch I use there.

One to a few instances of Epic Orchestra (Synchron Player), mostly the cornet or a string bass patch

I use controller events when possible to change articulations, or keyswitches where CC events aren't a possibility. I hate keyswitching, as it results in weird notes all over the place, and I work a lot in Cakewalk's staff view.

This results in 10-15 vsti's. Some have just one instrument, some a few, some a lot. My system is an i7 with 32 GB ram, and two WD Black HDDs, 1 TB each, with most of my samples on the second drive, except the ones that insist on being on the first. And Windows 7 Pro, which I plan to keep using indefinitely (this system is dedicated to music, and is offline by default. I have the Pro version of Malwarebytes on it, so I have little fear of using it past Windows 7 EOL in about a month).

This setup works great for me and my workflow. Some people have up to 128 GB ram, with two or more computers hooked up, 50-100 vsti's, etc. But I like to keep it simple. To match my level of technological ability.

 When I built my computer I had 16gb of memory in it. The MOBO I bought has provision for 128gb of memory. 

I've never had the need to add any more. I suppose I'm just a small composer in terms of building mixes. I started out as an acoustic player who likes smaller group arrangements most of the time. I have no one to please but myself in this...no tracks for anyone but me.

Having said that  my system is capable of some large mixes as it is. I've never pushed it that far. As a way to go around a bunch of that a person can always use an ensemble patch instead of loading 20 violas and 20 violins. Depending on the mix the average person won't know.

Colin is quite the composer and he makes some killer material. Who am I to say anything about how he does what he does? I admire anyone with this depth of commitment to their work.

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